The Slovak Yankee

Lionel de Welles, K.G.

I wrote the Thomas Bradbury article and it has a logical hypothesis on the royal line through the Fulnetbys.  I include it in my own database because I descend from Thomas Bradbury, but I also descend from the key couple in the line already.  That couple is Lionel de  Welles, the 6th Lord Welles who died in 1461 and his wife Joan de Waterton.  Among their children were:

1. Cecily de Welles m. Sir Robert Willoughby
2. Christopher Willoughby, 10th Lord Willoughby m. Margaret Jenney
3. Elizabeth Willoughby m. William Eure, 1st Lord Eure
4. Sir Ralph Eure m. Margery Bowes
5. Anne  Eure m. Lancelot Mansfield
6. John Mansfield m. Elizabeth (---)
7. Elizabeth Mansfield of Boston, Mass. m. John Wilson

 

1. Margaret de Welles, sister of Cicely m. Sir Thomas Dymoke
2. Jane Dymoke m. John Fulnetby
3. Katherine Fulnetby m. William Dynewell
4. Anne Dynewell m. Henry Whitgift
5. William Whitgift m. Margaret Bell
6. Elizabeth Whitgift m. Wymond Bradbury
7. Thomas Bradbury of Salisbury, Mass. m. Mary Perkins

So  I descend from this couple no matter what.  If this identification holds up then Elizabeth Mansfield and Thomas Bradbury were sixth cousins.  Lionel is given a page in the Ancestry of American Presidents.  Among his descendants are George Washington, Theodore Roosevelt, William Howard Taft, and both Bush presidents.

 Lionel is also an ancestor of Michael's royal ancestor Anne Skipwith Goforth.

1. Margaret de Welles m. Sir  Thomas  Dymoke
2. Lionel Dymoke m. Joan Griffith
3. Alice Dymoke m. William Skipwith
4. Henry Skipwith m. Jane Hall
5. Anne Skipwith m. Henry Smith
6. Sarah Smith m. Dr. Patrick Saunders
7. Honora Saunders m. Willoughby Skipwith (half third cousins through the Skipwith family)
8. Anne Skipwith, of Philadelphia, Penn. m. William Goforth

 

Visitations

I was enjoying a recent article in TAG on the Sothill and Fauconberge ancestry of William  Wentworth of New Hampshire.  He was the only New Hampshire person of gentry origins and of royal descent until I discovered Rose (Stoughton) Otis's background.  Now the Sanborn brothers make three New Hampshirites of royal descent.

Anyway,  William Wentworth has many descendants and it's been hard to prove a true royal line for him.  This TAG article shows previously unknown gentry and noble ancestors.  I was intrigued since I had Sothill and Fauconberge ancestry myself through other lines.  In 2007 I ghost wrote an article for the late Marshall Kirk  on the royal line of Thomas Bradbury.  That line went through the couple John Fulnetby and Jane Dymoke.  Using the 1562 Visitations of Lincolnshire I saw that John Fulnetby was the son of another John Fultnetby and a daughter of Gerard Sothill.  Using the TAG article, the time seemed to indicate that this was the same Gerard Sothill as in the TAG article.  This would give Thomas Bradbury some added ancestry.

I wrote to the author (since TAG is notoriously slow and I needed the second half of the article).  Sadly, he shot down my thesis and noted that the 1562 Visitations is very faulty on the Fulnetby family.

I already had many similar lines.  I descend from both Margery and  William Facounberge through the St. Quintin family which is ancestral to the Fitzhugh family (specifically Henry Fitzhugh, the 3rd Lord Fitzhugh and his wife Elizabeth de Grey.  I descend from three of their children).

I also descend from Sir Robert de Ros and his wife Isabel d'Aubigny through their children William and Mary.

Lastly, I descend from Sir John de Patshull and his wife Mabel de Grandison through their daughter Sibyl who married Sir Roger Beauchamp and are ancestral to Margaret de Beauchamp of whom I've recently written. 

So most of the ancestry lost by the Sothill connection I already had anyway through Anne Eure.

You can use  the Visitations for clues and they are accurate the closer they are to the date of the Visitation.  In this case 1562 is 150 years after the events in question.  Clearly there was a Fulnetby/Sothill connection (which will be revealed in the second part of the article) just not my connection.

 

Wikitree

I run google searches on my ancestors when doing research and just for fun. One site that comes up often is Wikitree.  I find Wikitree intriguing.  I  like it's setup with a pedigree format for ancestors.

I was using it for the Wilson family and generally speaking there's always more generations on a Wikitree than my database.  Wives have maiden names and generations extend one, two or more generations.  I never believe any of that.  In the case of  Gregory Belcher it had his mother's name, something I did not.  The page for her makes it clear that none of it could be true.  But someone did unearth a marriage record for a Thomas Belcher and Elizabeth Mason in nearby Mancetter which is where Gregory marries.  I find this compelling.  I also note they give burial dates for  both Thomas and  Elizabeth.  This is more information than I had.  Assuming no one is making this stuff up out  of whole cloth, these records exist.  As I stated in my own recounting of  Gregory Belcher, no one has done an article on his  English origins yet.  There seems to be good evidence of it.

But on the same thread, they had the parents of Nathaniel Spear who married Thankful Woodward as Ebenezer Spear and not Nathaniel Spear Sr.  This is demonstrably incorrect.  I couldn't see how to lodge a protest to correct it.

So I use Wikitree for clues.  Their medieval information is extensive but spelling and naming are not uniform so it can be difficult to navigate who is who.  It is a useful tool and more navigable that Ancestry's trees (which you have to pay for).

 

Margaret Beauchamp c. 1410-1482

It is tempting to think that my closest relationships to royalty are those of my Plantagenet ancestors.  Certainly, the children and grandchildren of Edward III had considerable pull in affairs of state.  But later on I have family members who had influence under the Tudor kings.

Margaret Beauchamp was the daughter of Sir John Beauchamp, the 3rd Lord Beauchamp of Bletsoe by his wife, Edith Stourton.  Margaret married three times to Sir Oliver Saint John then John Beaufort, the Duke of Somerset, and lastly, Lionel de Welles, 6th Lord Welles.  She had children by each husband.  By her first husband she had my ancestor Sir John St. John.  By her second husband she was the mother of Margaret Beaufort.  Margaret Beaufort would marry Edmund Tudor and be the mother of Henry VII.  So my ancestor Anne St. John, wife of Henry Clifford, 10th Lord Clifford was the half first cousin of the King.  A fairly close relationship.  Their daughter Elizabeth Clifford, the wife of Sir Ralph Bowes, would be the half second cousin of  Henry VIII. This relationship between the Cliffords and the Tudors was known and exploited.

These are the somewhat hidden relationships of our ancestors to royalty.

William Wilson, Canon of Windsor

Another place we will visit is Windsor where my ancestor William Wilson was canon from 1583 to 1615.  A graduate of Oxford (Merton College) he held four degrees: B.A. 1564, M.A. 1570, B.D. 1576, D.D. 1607.

I'm assuming his name is on a list posted somewhere at St. George's Chapel.  We'll see.

William's son John attended Cambridge University and became a minister and then his grandson John attended Harvard College and also became a minister.  So that's three generations in a row.

 

Archbishops of Canterbury

In addition to the murderer of Thomas Becket, Archbishop of Canterbury, I am closely related to three other archbishops.

1. Edmund Grindal 1576-1583 whose sister was
2. Elizabeth Grindall m. John Woodhull
3. Isabel Woodhull m. Rev. William Wilson
4. Rev. John Wilson, first minister of Boston m. Elizabeth Mansfield, granddaughter of Anne Eure

His successor was John Whitgift 1583-1604 (and who coronated James I) whose brother was

1. William Whitgift m. Margaret Bell
2. Elizabeth Whitgift m. Wymond Bradbury
3. Thomas Bradbury, emigrant of royal descent m. Mary Perkins, Salem witchcraft survivor

Lastly, among the siblings of Kenelm Winslow was his sister Magdalene Winslow who was the grandmother of William Wake, 1716-1737.

That's three archbishops of Canterbury I connect to.

 

 

Sir William de Tracy

In a few weeks I'm going to England for the second time (first time in 1984).  Although I won't be doing any genealogical research, I will be seeing many sites that I have a genealogical tie to.  One such outing will be Canterbury.  The murder of Saint Thomas Becket by four knights of Henry II is well known.  Henry certainly took the blame and I descend from him innumerable times.

One of the four knights who murdered Thomas Becket was Sir William de Tracy.  I descend from him too.

1. Sir William de Tracy m. Rohese de Pomeroy
2. Rose de Tracy m. Henry Champernoun
3. Sir Oliver Champernoun m. Wymarca (---)
4. Sir Henry Champernoun m. Dionisia English
5. Dionisia Champernoun m. William de Botreaux
6. Sir William de Botreaux m. (---)
7. Margaret de Botreaux m. Sir John de Dinham
8. Sir John de Dinham m. Muriel Courtenay
9. Sir John de Dinham m. Ellen de Montagu
10. Muriel de Dinham m. Edward Hastings, 8th Lord Hastings
11. John Hastings, 9th Lord Hastings m. Anne Morley
12. Hugh Hastings, 10th Lord Hastings m. Anne Gascoigne
13. Muriel Hastings m. Sir Ralph Eure
14. William Eure, 1st Lord Eure m. Elizabeth Willoughby
15. Sir Ralph Eure m. Margery Bowes
16. Anne Eure, paternal grandmother of Elizabeth (Mansfield) Wilson of Boston, Mass.

 

Queen Camilla

I mentioned yesterday the various ways I'm related to members of the royal  family.  One I forgot is  Queen Camilla.  William Addams Reitswiesner laid out her ancestry in 2006.  She has a line that comes from Canada and that Canadian line has an American loyalist in  it from Weston, Massachusetts.  That gives Camilla four Watertown ancestors that I descend from:  Lewis and Anne Jones and Nathaniel Treadway and his wife Sufferance Haynes.  So I share 17th century ancestors with her.

But that only holds true if the  Hon. George Keppel was her great-grandfather.  It is rumored that Alice's affair with Edward VII yielded a child.  Who knows?  If Charles and Camilla took DNA tests and turn out to be third cousins, then we would know.

1. Lewis Jones m. Anne                            Nathaniel Treadway m. Sufferance Haynes
2. Lydia Jones m. Jonathan Whitney    Elizabeth Treadway m. Shadrach Hapgood
3. John Whitney m. Mary Hapgood
4. Mary Whitney m. Daniel Moore
5. Abigail Moore m. Edward Learned
6. Benjamin Learned m. Margaret Swan
7. Amos Learned m. Polly Daniels
8. Abiah Russell Learned m. Benjamin Wingate Hurd
9. Olive Ann Hurd m.  George Hale Pinkham
10. Burt Hale Pinkham m. Kate Kinmond
11. Clarence Melvin Pinkham, my grandfather

 

Coronation Day

I did not get up to watch the coronation.  I got up early in 1981 to watch the royal wedding of  Charles  and Diana and we all know how that turned out.

My common royal ancestor with Charles III is Edward III who lived 700 years ago.  However, I'm more closely related to Charles through his maternal grandmother, the late Queen Mother who was born Lady Elizabeth Bowes-Lyon.  My ancestor Sir Ralph Bowes c. 1480-1516 is an ancestor of the Queen Mother, the late Queen and current King.  That's only 500 years ago.

In the next generation I'm much more closely related to the Prince of Wales through his later mother Diana.  But not through her American ancestors but through her Scottish ancestors.  We share 18th century Milne ancestors in Scotland.  That's only 300 years ago.

I am related too to the Princess of Wales through the Gascoigne family but that again is 15th century England and 600 years ago. (William Gascoigne and Margaret Clarell).

So I am more closely related to the spouses of the monarchs than to the monarchs themselves.  I wonder (if you could calculate it) what number I am in line to  the throne.  I have a  legitimate descent from  the elder line of Lionel of Antwerp.  So what am I?  50 millionth to the throne?  70 millionth to the throne?  I wonder.

 

Michael's Descent from Edward I of England

Michael has three ancestors of royal descent and possibly four.  Anne (Skipwith) (Goforth) Oxley descends from Edward III in four lines from three of his sons; Matthew Clarkson of New York; and Thomas and Elinor Jarnagin of Virginia.

1. Edward I m. Eleanor of Castile
2. Joan m. Gilbert de Clare, 3rd Earl of Gloucester, 7th Earl of Hertford
3. Elizabeth de  Clare m. Roger Damory, 1st Baron Damory
4. Elizabeth Damory m. John Bardolf, 3rd Baron Bardolf
5. William Bardolf, 4th Baron Bardolf m. Agnes Poynings
6. Cecily Bardolf m. Sir Brian Stapleton
7. Sir Miles Stapleton m. Catherine de la Pole
8. Elizabeth Stapleton m. Sir William Calthorpe
9. Anne Calthorpe m. Sir  Robert Drury, Speaker of the House of Commons
10. Bridget Drury m. Sir John Jernegan
11. George Jernegan m. Ela Spelman
12. Thomas Jernegan m. Elizabeth Thompson
13. Thomas Jernegan m. Elinor (---)
14. Thomas Jernegan of Virginia  and Elinor Jernegan m. Thomas Lamkin of Virginia

14. Thomas Jernegan m. (---)

15. John Jernegan m. Temperance Moore

16. Thomas Jernegan m. Elizabeth (---)

17. John Jarnagin m. Mary Bynum

18. Thomas Jarnagin m. Mary Lavinia Witt

19. Chesley Jarnagin m. Martha Barton

20. Lavinia Lea Jarnagin m. Dr. William Isaac Irvine Morrow

21. William Lindsey Morrow m. Sarah Ann Glenn

22. Alice May Morrow m. Charles Chester Clark

23. William Lynn Clark m. Ruth Berrigan

24. Edmund Berrigan Clark m. Doris Clark Ridpath

25. Michael Berrigan Clark m. Martin Edward Hollick

The alternative line is:

14. Eleanor Jernigan m. Thomas Lamkin

15. George Lamkin m. Hannah Cox

16. James Lamkin m. Jane  Johnstone

17. Jane Lamkin m. Richard Straughn

18. John Corbin Straughn m. Mary  Saunders

19. John Corbin Straughn, Jr. m. Obedience Scott

20. Duranda Straughn m. John Wesley Ridpath

21. Daniel Burton Ridpath m. Vida Hamlin Clarkson

22. John Wesley Ridpath m. Nell Carmon

23. Doris Carmon Ridpath m. Edmund Berrigan Clark, nos. 24 above and thus cousins.