The Slovak Yankee

Interrelated Royal Gateways

If my assumption that Thomas Bradbury's Fulnetby ancestors descend from the Sothills (and that's just one generation back in the visitations from provable ancestry), then Thomas Bradbury and William Wentworth are fifth cousins once removed.   Likewise Thomas Bradbury and Elizabeth (Mansfield) Wilson are sixth cousins via Lionel de Welles.

John Fulnetby

The Fulnetby's weren't very imaginative and named the heir of their line John Fulnetby for five generations.   Therefore you have to sort through all the John Fulnetby's and assign to them a correct wife or wives.

 

1. John Fulnetby born say 1390 was alive in April 1429 when he is named in a lawsuit with his wife.  He was the son of John Fulnetby and Eleanor Skipwith.  John married Jane (or Joan) Towers who was also alive in April 1429.
2. John Fulnetby born say 1420.  He married a daughter of Gerard Sothill according to the Visitations.
3. John Fulnetby born about 1455 and died before 3 November 1528.  He married twice, first to Elizabeth Eland by whom he had two daughters and then to Jane Dymoke born say 1465, daughter of Sir Thomas Dymoke and Margaret de Welles.  Through this marriage all descendants share a descent from Edward I of England.
4. Several children including Godfrey Fulnetby and Katherine Fulnetby and Elizabeth Fulnetby who married Gerard Sothill.  Godfrey married a Goodrich which made him and his sisters near kin of the Bishop of Ely.

You can see that Visitations clearly note a Fulnetby and Sothill marriage but disagree when and which generation.  However, by marriage #2 if provable Thomas Bradbury would have additional royal ancestry as follows:

1. William I, "the Lion" King of Scotland with Isabel Avenal
2. Isabel of Scotland m. Robert de Ros
3. Sir Robert de Ros m. Christine Bertram
4. Robert de Ros m. Margaret Brus
5. Robert de Ros m. Laura (---)
6. Margaret de Ros m. John Salweyn
7. Sir Gerard Salvain m. Agnes Mauleverer
8. Sir Gerard Salvain m. Alice (---)
9. Muriel Salvain m. Sir Gerard Sothill
10. daughter m. John Fulnetby
11. John Fulnetby m. Jane Dymoke
12. Katherine Fulnetby m. William Dynewell
13. Anne Dynewell m. Henry Whitgift
14. William Whitgift m. Margaret Bell
15. Elizabeth Whitgift m. Wymond Bradbury
16. Thomas Bradbury

 

*Caution.  The above pedigree is rendered no good by the completion of the William Wentworth article which shows Sir Gerald Sothill married a Joan (---) Wascelin.  The Salvain descent is thrown out.

David I and Holyrood Abbey

We went to visit Holyrood Palace in Edinburgh which is the king's official residence in Scotland.  Next to the palace are the ruins of Holyrood Abbey which was built by King David I of Scotland in memory of his mother St. Margaret of Scotland.

David I c. 1080-1153 has a single son through which you can descend, Henry of Huntingdon, Earl of Northumberland.  But I descend through five of Henry's children:

• William I the Lion of Scotland (through two of his daughters)
• David de Huntingdon, Earl of Huntingdon (through three of his daughters)
• Margaret de Huntingdon wife of Humphrey IV de Bohun
• Ada de Huntingdon wife of Florent III, Count of Holland
• Marjory de Huntingdon, wife of Gilchrist de Angus, Earl of Angus

I've already written a posting on the descent of Scottish kings to Anne Eure.  William the Lion is the royal ancestor of Peter Worden.

 

Lionel de Welles, K.G.

I wrote the Thomas Bradbury article and it has a logical hypothesis on the royal line through the Fulnetbys.  I include it in my own database because I descend from Thomas Bradbury, but I also descend from the key couple in the line already.  That couple is Lionel de  Welles, the 6th Lord Welles who died in 1461 and his wife Joan de Waterton.  Among their children were:

1. Cecily de Welles m. Sir Robert Willoughby
2. Christopher Willoughby, 10th Lord Willoughby m. Margaret Jenney
3. Elizabeth Willoughby m. William Eure, 1st Lord Eure
4. Sir Ralph Eure m. Margery Bowes
5. Anne  Eure m. Lancelot Mansfield
6. John Mansfield m. Elizabeth (---)
7. Elizabeth Mansfield of Boston, Mass. m. John Wilson

 

1. Margaret de Welles, sister of Cicely m. Sir Thomas Dymoke
2. Jane Dymoke m. John Fulnetby
3. Katherine Fulnetby m. William Dynewell
4. Anne Dynewell m. Henry Whitgift
5. William Whitgift m. Margaret Bell
6. Elizabeth Whitgift m. Wymond Bradbury
7. Thomas Bradbury of Salisbury, Mass. m. Mary Perkins

So  I descend from this couple no matter what.  If this identification holds up then Elizabeth Mansfield and Thomas Bradbury were sixth cousins.  Lionel is given a page in the Ancestry of American Presidents.  Among his descendants are George Washington, Theodore Roosevelt, William Howard Taft, and both Bush presidents.

 Lionel is also an ancestor of Michael's royal ancestor Anne Skipwith Goforth.

1. Margaret de Welles m. Sir  Thomas  Dymoke
2. Lionel Dymoke m. Joan Griffith
3. Alice Dymoke m. William Skipwith
4. Henry Skipwith m. Jane Hall
5. Anne Skipwith m. Henry Smith
6. Sarah Smith m. Dr. Patrick Saunders
7. Honora Saunders m. Willoughby Skipwith (half third cousins through the Skipwith family)
8. Anne Skipwith, of Philadelphia, Penn. m. William Goforth

 

Visitations

I was enjoying a recent article in TAG on the Sothill and Fauconberge ancestry of William  Wentworth of New Hampshire.  He was the only New Hampshire person of gentry origins and of royal descent until I discovered Rose (Stoughton) Otis's background.  Now the Sanborn brothers make three New Hampshirites of royal descent.

Anyway,  William Wentworth has many descendants and it's been hard to prove a true royal line for him.  This TAG article shows previously unknown gentry and noble ancestors.  I was intrigued since I had Sothill and Fauconberge ancestry myself through other lines.  In 2007 I ghost wrote an article for the late Marshall Kirk  on the royal line of Thomas Bradbury.  That line went through the couple John Fulnetby and Jane Dymoke.  Using the 1562 Visitations of Lincolnshire I saw that John Fulnetby was the son of another John Fultnetby and a daughter of Gerard Sothill.  Using the TAG article, the time seemed to indicate that this was the same Gerard Sothill as in the TAG article.  This would give Thomas Bradbury some added ancestry.

I wrote to the author (since TAG is notoriously slow and I needed the second half of the article).  Sadly, he shot down my thesis and noted that the 1562 Visitations is very faulty on the Fulnetby family.

I already had many similar lines.  I descend from both Margery and  William Facounberge through the St. Quintin family which is ancestral to the Fitzhugh family (specifically Henry Fitzhugh, the 3rd Lord Fitzhugh and his wife Elizabeth de Grey.  I descend from three of their children).

I also descend from Sir Robert de Ros and his wife Isabel d'Aubigny through their children William and Mary.

Lastly, I descend from Sir John de Patshull and his wife Mabel de Grandison through their daughter Sibyl who married Sir Roger Beauchamp and are ancestral to Margaret de Beauchamp of whom I've recently written. 

So most of the ancestry lost by the Sothill connection I already had anyway through Anne Eure.

You can use  the Visitations for clues and they are accurate the closer they are to the date of the Visitation.  In this case 1562 is 150 years after the events in question.  Clearly there was a Fulnetby/Sothill connection (which will be revealed in the second part of the article) just not my connection.

 

Queen Camilla

I mentioned yesterday the various ways I'm related to members of the royal  family.  One I forgot is  Queen Camilla.  William Addams Reitswiesner laid out her ancestry in 2006.  She has a line that comes from Canada and that Canadian line has an American loyalist in  it from Weston, Massachusetts.  That gives Camilla four Watertown ancestors that I descend from:  Lewis and Anne Jones and Nathaniel Treadway and his wife Sufferance Haynes.  So I share 17th century ancestors with her.

But that only holds true if the  Hon. George Keppel was her great-grandfather.  It is rumored that Alice's affair with Edward VII yielded a child.  Who knows?  If Charles and Camilla took DNA tests and turn out to be third cousins, then we would know.

1. Lewis Jones m. Anne                            Nathaniel Treadway m. Sufferance Haynes
2. Lydia Jones m. Jonathan Whitney    Elizabeth Treadway m. Shadrach Hapgood
3. John Whitney m. Mary Hapgood
4. Mary Whitney m. Daniel Moore
5. Abigail Moore m. Edward Learned
6. Benjamin Learned m. Margaret Swan
7. Amos Learned m. Polly Daniels
8. Abiah Russell Learned m. Benjamin Wingate Hurd
9. Olive Ann Hurd m.  George Hale Pinkham
10. Burt Hale Pinkham m. Kate Kinmond
11. Clarence Melvin Pinkham, my grandfather

 

Coronation Day

I did not get up to watch the coronation.  I got up early in 1981 to watch the royal wedding of  Charles  and Diana and we all know how that turned out.

My common royal ancestor with Charles III is Edward III who lived 700 years ago.  However, I'm more closely related to Charles through his maternal grandmother, the late Queen Mother who was born Lady Elizabeth Bowes-Lyon.  My ancestor Sir Ralph Bowes c. 1480-1516 is an ancestor of the Queen Mother, the late Queen and current King.  That's only 500 years ago.

In the next generation I'm much more closely related to the Prince of Wales through his later mother Diana.  But not through her American ancestors but through her Scottish ancestors.  We share 18th century Milne ancestors in Scotland.  That's only 300 years ago.

I am related too to the Princess of Wales through the Gascoigne family but that again is 15th century England and 600 years ago. (William Gascoigne and Margaret Clarell).

So I am more closely related to the spouses of the monarchs than to the monarchs themselves.  I wonder (if you could calculate it) what number I am in line to  the throne.  I have a  legitimate descent from  the elder line of Lionel of Antwerp.  So what am I?  50 millionth to the throne?  70 millionth to the throne?  I wonder.

 

Michael's Descent from Edward I of England

Michael has three ancestors of royal descent and possibly four.  Anne (Skipwith) (Goforth) Oxley descends from Edward III in four lines from three of his sons; Matthew Clarkson of New York; and Thomas and Elinor Jarnagin of Virginia.

1. Edward I m. Eleanor of Castile
2. Joan m. Gilbert de Clare, 3rd Earl of Gloucester, 7th Earl of Hertford
3. Elizabeth de  Clare m. Roger Damory, 1st Baron Damory
4. Elizabeth Damory m. John Bardolf, 3rd Baron Bardolf
5. William Bardolf, 4th Baron Bardolf m. Agnes Poynings
6. Cecily Bardolf m. Sir Brian Stapleton
7. Sir Miles Stapleton m. Catherine de la Pole
8. Elizabeth Stapleton m. Sir William Calthorpe
9. Anne Calthorpe m. Sir  Robert Drury, Speaker of the House of Commons
10. Bridget Drury m. Sir John Jernegan
11. George Jernegan m. Ela Spelman
12. Thomas Jernegan m. Elizabeth Thompson
13. Thomas Jernegan m. Elinor (---)
14. Thomas Jernegan of Virginia  and Elinor Jernegan m. Thomas Lamkin of Virginia

14. Thomas Jernegan m. (---)

15. John Jernegan m. Temperance Moore

16. Thomas Jernegan m. Elizabeth (---)

17. John Jarnagin m. Mary Bynum

18. Thomas Jarnagin m. Mary Lavinia Witt

19. Chesley Jarnagin m. Martha Barton

20. Lavinia Lea Jarnagin m. Dr. William Isaac Irvine Morrow

21. William Lindsey Morrow m. Sarah Ann Glenn

22. Alice May Morrow m. Charles Chester Clark

23. William Lynn Clark m. Ruth Berrigan

24. Edmund Berrigan Clark m. Doris Clark Ridpath

25. Michael Berrigan Clark m. Martin Edward Hollick

The alternative line is:

14. Eleanor Jernigan m. Thomas Lamkin

15. George Lamkin m. Hannah Cox

16. James Lamkin m. Jane  Johnstone

17. Jane Lamkin m. Richard Straughn

18. John Corbin Straughn m. Mary  Saunders

19. John Corbin Straughn, Jr. m. Obedience Scott

20. Duranda Straughn m. John Wesley Ridpath

21. Daniel Burton Ridpath m. Vida Hamlin Clarkson

22. John Wesley Ridpath m. Nell Carmon

23. Doris Carmon Ridpath m. Edmund Berrigan Clark, nos. 24 above and thus cousins.

 

Matrilineal Lines

I find that matrilineal lines run out often quickly.  Mine goes back nine generations, but medieval matrilineal lines often don't last that long.

1. Edward III
2. Isabella, Princess of France
3. Joan, Princess of Navarre
4. Blanche of Artois
5. Matilda of Brabant
6. Maria, Princess of Germany
7. Princess Irene Angelica of Byzantium
8. Wife of Emperor Isaac II Angelos of Byzantium

 

1. Philippa of Hainault
2. Jeanne Valois
3. Marguerite Princess of  Sicily and Naples
4. Maria, Princess of Hungary
5. Elizabeth, Princess of Bosnia

 

1. Anne Eure c. 1530-c. 1566, my medieval gateway ancestor
2. Margery Bowes
3. Elizabeth Clifford
4. Anne Saint John
5. Alice Bradshaw
6. Alice Sherburne
7. Yrmane de Bradkirke

 

 

 

Eleanor of Aquitaine Descents IV

These lines do you go back to royalty but lead to the English aristocracy. 

1. Eleanor of Aquitaine m. Henry II, King of England
2. Eleanor m. Alfonso VIII, King of Castile
3. Berengaria m. Alfonso IX, King of Castile and Leon
4. Bergengaria of Castile m. Jean de Brienne, King of Jerusalem
5. Jean de Brienne, Grand Butler of France m. Jeanne de Chateaudun
6. Blanche de Brienne m. William II de Fiennes
7. Margaret de Fiennes m. Edmund Mortimer, 7th Lord Mortimer

From here many lines fall to the English aristocracy. You get all future Mortimers, the Earls of March.

4. Berengaria of Castile m. Jean de  Brienne, King of Jerusalem

5. Louis de Brienne, Vicomte de Beaumont m. Agnes de Beaumont

6. Henry de Beaumont, Earl of Buchan m. Alice Comyn

7. John de Beaumont, 2nd Lord Beaumont m. Eleanor of Lancaster, great granddaughter of Henry III, King of England

From  here the further Lords Beaumont fall and much of English aristocracy.